That said though, I’ve had worse from other vendors – and that’s why I don’t buy their products anymore. Meh.

http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=MP3314

Won’t buy ASUS again

I imagine your brother may be feeling disconnected, alone, ashamed and guilty if he isn’t receiving treatment, or communicating with anyone who knows what it’s like to deal with depression. There’s so much stigma still surrounding mental health, that many sufferers I’ve now spoken with feel as though they’ve let themselves and their families down by succumbing to it. They (me included), struggle to accept that it’s NOT a personal failing, and there are many others (they probably know some but don’t even realise), who struggle with the same symptoms

I’m sorry I have to disagree with some of this. Whilst I do encourage everyone to seek professional help, I’ve been down that road and found it caused a lot more problems and no longer see anyone because of it. Mental health in this country has a lot of pitfalls and like everything requires a skeptical eye. (This is a very personal choice, most of my issues right now are situational. I’ve dealt with depression since I was 8, so I have a lot of stuff that I’ve worked out by now to help me cope.) This is a preface for my actual point:

I do think I should probably see someone, but I don’t feel guilty or ashamed that I don’t. I’ve never ever ever felt guilty or ashamed.

Other people try to make me feel that way, as if I can just stop being this way or like I just need to ‘get on with life’ and ‘make the best of it’ or like if they don’t see me upset or see me at all, then everything’s fine. Most days nobody realises I’m contemplating suicide or that I’m struggling to ‘get on with it’. But I’ve not once felt like I’ve let anyone down: this is as much of an illness as cancer or measles. You don’t feel like you’re letting people down if you get cancer, and you certainly don’t get to blame the cancer sufferer for ‘succumbing’ to it. As far as I’m concerned the people who make me feel bad about my illness can f* off.

I know that’s not what you meant Lucas (about all sufferers feeling guilty) and I do agree with most of what you say, but I wanted to point this out because you can easily slip into reinforcing stereotypes and typical stigma-thinking without realising it. (Heck, I do it too. And I hope that you do eventually feel blameless)

If we could get other people to understand that when you go into your room for a few days, or you shirk responsibilities, or you need something else – it’s not selfishness and it’s not on purpose, and it’s not laziness – then we depressed people would have a much better support system. That people see us doing these quiet, subtle things but don’t see the ‘aftermath’ going on in our heads means that they assume there’s nothing wrong; or that there’s a normal reason for it. (And I say this having spent most of my life being unable to express that very fact to my parents. It’s a very hard thing to deal with where you get blamed, and looked at with anger and disappointment, and treated like a naughty kid for something that is just not under your control)

This is what I meant earlier about support. It’s about knowing that the person you love isn’t walking away on purpose. … Anyway, like I said, I know it’s not what you meant but I still wanted to point it out. This is a skeptical site after all…

PS. I hope blockquotes work…

Of course I, like Flip, am no expert in these things, and can only offer you the benefit of my limited personal persepctive.

You said your brother has been diagnosed with depression: May I ask, was he diagnosed by a psychologist, and is he receiving treatment?

I imagine your brother may be feeling disconnected, alone, ashamed and guilty if he isn’t receiving treatment, or communicating with anyone who knows what it’s like to deal with depression. There’s so much stigma still surrounding mental health, that many sufferers I’ve now spoken with feel as though they’ve let themselves and their families down by succumbing to it. They (me included), struggle to accept that it’s NOT a personal failing, and there are many others (they probably know some but don’t even realise), who struggle with the same symptoms.

Personally, I found talking about it with others who understood, and had been through similar things, helped me enormously. It helped normalise what I was dealing with, which reduced the guilt and shame, allowing me to step back and look at it as what it really is – a normal human condition.

I really hope your brother finds his way, and I’m sorry I can’t offer you much advise on how to encourage him to seek help. I think you need to tell him that you are prepared to listen without judgement if he wants to talk, that you love him and support him regardless, and that whenever he is ready to seek help, you will do what you can to support that process.

Good luck.

Lucas.

As someone who is currently doing most of what you’re brother is doing, and a little bit older (although some of ‘being isolated’ for me is due to my work, as I’m self-employed. I’m not missing bills yet though and if I do it’ll be because of lack of money rather than lack of will).

Part of the problem for me – and I can only speak about me, your brother may be different, and I am NOT a mental health professional so it’s really just my advice – is that I feel that no one cares and no one will listen. Especially for me, I have tried talking to my parents and friends in the past, but they either pass off my comments as “oh, it’s just a phase” or “this is too heavy, I have my own problems, don’t put this shit on me”. In particular, I hope you are pro-science. My family is considerably into woo and it makes it hard to discuss treatment with them. My mum’s idea of helping is to buy me presents – none of which I am actually interested – and suggest vitamins. Instead of trying to put your own ideas of how to approach this onto him, just give him the space, time and encouragement to listen openly. In my case, I don’t so much want a response, as acceptance. If you want to encourage him to open up, I’d just occasionally ask how he is, and start small, on subjects that he is comfortable talking about.

On reading your list of symptoms again, mine are more situational: I live at home with my parents but want to move out. It’s been incredibly noisy in this house the last few years and as I work from home with no set hours, I find I have to work from 1am on til 6am in order to get anything done. This constant source of noise means I’ve lost all interest in talking to the people who make it; add to that a considered source of tension in the house due to my ‘not getting a normal job’ and it’s hard to want to be around that disappointment/judgemental attitude. I’m not saying this is what’s happening for your brother, just that it’s very easy from your side of things to not know causes for actions – mine is semi-reasonable, but because I’m tired of being ignored when I want some quiet, I don’t bother explaining myself anymore.

Isolation: well, I’ve lost all of my friends over the years, due to lack of contact (mostly on their side, partly on mine) and lack of a steady job. My work is all online, so isolation comes quickly. Even so, I find it difficult to go out (ignoring lack of money to do things with) because I’m also not the prettiest person or the fittest and it’s hard to not feel uncomfortable with other people; I’ve never been sociable anyway.

While I do recommend trying to encourage him to participate, it can easily swing in the other direction. Most of the time, I just want to do my own thing in my own time: it’s likely he’s trying to work a lot of stuff out in his head, but you just don’t see it, so you don’t know. If you do want him to participate, do it gently, don’t force him, and find something he’s genuinely interested in doing. I am totally unsociable right now, but am willing to head out of the house for things I’m *extremely* passionate about. There’s a lot of stuff I can ‘safely’ do from home too, so even if he’s not willing to go out, maybe there’s an activity at home that he might enjoy?

Don’t underestimate the need for giving him a little space. Too much nagging and it won’t help. I’d also advise you to seek assistance yourself. Hopefully there are family support groups out there, but if not I’d bet a helpline, doctor, or psychologist could be useful.

Lastly I’ll add that I know how you feel. I had to watch my parents watch me become so distraught I ended up in hospital. Even though I was ‘out of it’ I was fully aware of the look on their faces and how upsetting it was for them. I understand that my actions do hurt them, but I guarantee you he is feeling just as helpless – and far more alone. It’s hard to speak out when all you want to do is to be left alone: it’s a symptom and not at all something you can control or deal with easily.

I know your comments were directed at Lucas, but as my situation is so much the same it really moved me to write a reply. I hope that at least some of it might shed some light. I’m subscribed to receive replies to these comments, and if you’d like to talk privately just let me know.

(See, I’m having a ‘better’ day and my comments are more normal)